oh yeah, forgot about that blame the beers. But the point remains, I wasn’t claiming it as an achievement, more an indictment of fhe rest of the league - especially the “Top 6”, tbh.
Assuming we do go on to win it, just imagine the fallout if City pip Arsenal to 2nd after being so utterly dogshit for so long.
I know @njmcfc1894 touched on it yesterday but other than a bit of pride it doesn't really matter if it's 2nd, 3rd or 4th. The prize, or maybe lack of it (not champions), is the same at that point.
10 years ago it mattered for to seeding for groups , City will be happy with 4th , id rather not catch Arsenal of it meant they won the league (know it won't cheer you up) , we won't win CL this season, with position we are finishing if we qualify we are gonna get a tough 2 legged tie, fa cup our only hope of silverware but after 6 trophies in last 2 seasons I can hardly moan. Been a good PL season for surprises, a lot of top clubs getting noses out out of joint.
I'm referring to what ultimately finishing behind City will symbolise, rather than the practical difference.
Disagree with this, I see what position you finish aids you the next season too. If for instance City pipped Arsenal for second (if we do win the league) that would be massively deflating for Arsenal (given its supposedly a 2 horse race) and may well effect them next season, it would also give City a lot more belief. Whereas if Arsenal stayed clear in second place, they go into next season with a lot more confidence and we all know how important confidence and momentum is in football, its huge. I've always been of the thought of finishing above as many teams as possible, especially if they are rivals. City haven't finished outside the top 2 for what? 6/7 seasons now? It all makes them look all the more invincible. If Arsenal pip them, that run is broken, would do Arsenal a huge ammount of good just finishing above them, may also instil some doubt in City. Could also effect player purchases. Player both City and Arsenal are after will look at where each team is finishing, which team looks like its on the up (or down) and may well decide on that.
Seeding was the only reason to avoid 4th but as you said, that changed so is less relevant now. I don't agree with NJ in wanting Arsenal to finish above them. I agree in the sentiment of finishing as high as you can but ultimately the difference in position is minimal. I think there are a lot of other factors that determine where a club are truly at rather than a one off season's positioning. I knew the year that Leicester won the league that our style of playing was more sustainable and that we'd continue to improve. I wasn't surprised we finished above them the following season. Similarly I've seen us finish above City and still know they'd be a more attractive proposition than ourselves. We were much better than City the year Walker left us and he ultimately made the right decision in leaving us. I think Arsenal will feel disheartened wherever they finish in all honesty. They had an opportunity with the way City's season has gone and what looked like would be a season of transition for Liverpool. They'll be as disappointed about where they've finished in relation to Liverpool as they will about City imo. Nobody expected City to have the season they have but I imagine most people thought Arsenal would have been the ones to capitalise on it.
Again, I disagree, yes Arsenal will be disappointed not winning the league (if they dont), but finishing above City could be a huge boost. I dont think City will find it easy to bounce back in truth, their squad is getting old now their talisman De Bruyne is on his last year or so, Walker gone, Stones always injured, Gundogan looks a shadow of the great player he was, same with Bernardo, etc thats the spine of their great team of the last decade. Yes they can buy more players, but there is no guarantee these will be successes, we've already seen Grealish flop, Savinhno not much better, Nunes is several levels below what they are used to. So now is the perfect time for Arsenal to overhaul them...first step is finishing above them, get that monkey off their shoulder then push on, small steps can be huge in football, as I said, momentum and confidence, massively understated in sport.
I just don't think Arsenal finishing above Manchester City will give them any more confidence that they can then go and win the league next year. You're talking about momentum and confidence but I think there'll already be a feeling they've gone backwards this season. You obviously don't want to finish even further down the league but I don't think they'll get this massive boost from finishing above City. They'll be equally concerned that Liverpool have overtaken them, that they'll get better in Slot's second and that there are a lot more winners in Liverpool's squad. Tottenham finished above every club in England under Pochettino but it doesn't guarantee anything unless you do it when it matters. If you don't kick on and improve every season you'll still have question marks and self doubt in the important moments. Arteta and Arsenal will obviously want to focus on the positives of the season but I don't think they'll get a huge boost from finishing second again tbh.
Finishing 2nd above City will obviously be better than finishing 3rd below them. But ultimately anything other than winning the title will be a failure given that you could argue that the current squad is over its peak and, without fresh purchases, they're now going to descend. Even finishing 2nd will be little more than what they have done twice consecutively in the last two seasons. And if you combine that with no domestic or European silverware (which is looking likely), then it will be difficult to view Arteta's first five years in charge as being anything other than mediocre at best. Go forward 20 years no one will give a shit about or even realise that they finished 2nd three years on the bounce.
I'm far more interested in how many points we accumulate, not where we finish. I'd rather break 80 points and come 4th then limp to 70 points and hide behind a second place finish. I tihnk if we can break 80 points again and establish that floor of consistentcy in spite of the injuries we've suffered this year it'll be a good platform to go again next year. In fact I'd make the argument this season could be seen as a break mentally. Ok, it hasn't quite got going this year, congrats to Liverpool and we go again next year. Finishing above City and having nothing better to show for it is as good as finishing below them imo. You can make that argument if you want but you'd be wrong If we assume Zubimendi does join in the summer, the average age of our strongest XI will be 25.4 come the summer. I appreciate players 'peak' at different times but I'm really struggling to accept the point that a whole eleven will have already peaked at an average age of 25. It's truthfully a really weak argument. Now if you'd said that a lack of success may make players want to look elsewhere and leave, that's a significantly more plausible outcome. You don't need to tell Arsenal fans of my age about that, we've been through it all once already with the 2007-2011 squad. I'm fully aware Real Madrid are probably already in Saliba's ear, I know Saka, Gabriel and Martinelli have two years left. We've got work to do and we've got to show we're ambitious enough to work to win. I know the manager is.
I know the general consensus on here is Liverpool have the title in the bag but I still think Arsenal are within a decent shout . If Liverpool lose away to Bournemouth next weekend and Arsenal beat City both results more than feasible then the gap is down to 3 points with 15 games to go. Next weekend could potentially be huge for one side or the other if Liverpool win and Arsenal drop points and we win game in hand that ends it imo. Second Liverpool go 10/11 points clear title race is done you're not pulling that back at this stage of the season. But yeah still not ruling Arsenal out yet too early.
The general consensus is desperate to set lfc fans up when the lot of them have seen bigger points tallies over hauled. City play lfc thry can win amd be right back in thr hunt. Arsenal play lfc. Thry can really close the gap. As we sit here lfc need to go to Bournemouth and win next weekend or the gap will shrink. Imo lfc need to win all the games up to the city one and then at the very worst not lose it.
Looks like 5th is a cl spot in all but name. The English coefficient is 14.34 and 3rd place is Italy on 11.05.
Looks increasingly likely that England will have that extra Champions League place. Think all are well placed to go far in their tournaments. For some context, England's coefficient for the season is currently 20.892. Last season's top two countries: Italy (21.000) and Germany (19.357) So it's possible we've already done enough assuming that all seven clubs immediately exit in the next round. Realistically we'll probably have at least one finalist in Chelsea and hopefully another in Spurs
We aren't well placed to go far, we've got Bayern or Madrid , **** this 5th place. It's getting ridiculous
